It has been a busy week and I have not had the time to work on another post. However, I did reread my December 6th post, and was amazed at how quickly and accurately others have fulfilled my predictions. I have posted it again below. Enjoy
What to look for in a SB Blog Post
Last year a stir was created in the SBC over apparent Theological Issues. This summer this controversy was extended from Baptism/Tongues to Alcohol and even women pastors. At GuardianMinistries we are systematically addressing these issues and explaining why Southern Baptists have always stood where we stand today. Nevertheless, as more conversation takes place as to the validity of the historical position of SB on these issues, I imagine the ones who initiated this controversy will switch tactics.
I feel quite confident that when those generating the controversy realize they can’t win the theological debate they will begin a more subtle political maneuver of playing on individual’s emotions. However, this ploy will also fail, for Southern Baptists are smarter than that.
Nevertheless, the following is what I expect to see in the future:
1. Accusations or insinuations of a Pope or puppet-master in the SBC. These accusations or insinuations will have no merit other than the imaginations of conspiracy-theorists in our convention. However, the lack of merit will not stop some from making such attacks.
2. Emotional pleas for individuals who have been “apparently” mistreated or “left out”…and yet in reality the individuals will usually have brought their isolation on themselves (***the latter is not so much the case in some of the current discussions, hence the word I used was "usually"***).
3. Claims of “narrowing parameters” will be consistently made as a scare tactic to Calvinists and young pastors.
4. Emotional pleas to make the tent wider will be made.
With this in mind here are my suggestions for reading blogs:
1. If there are insinuations in a blog post that there is a pope or power-master in the SBC, ask yourself, “Did the blogger site any evidence WHATSOEVER or does he/she just expect us to trust their conspiracy theory?”
2. Did the blog post deal with any theological issue or was there some “tug” on people’s heart-strings for a certain political movement or personality in the SBC?
3. If there is a claim that SB are “narrowing parameters,” ask yourself, “if any evidence is given, or if this is a scare tactic born out of conspiracy-theorists?”
4. If you read a plea to make the tent wider, ask yourself, “at what cost to truth do we want peace?” Ecumenicalism is not evil and Christians should cooperate with other denominations, but there is a reason I am a Southern Baptists and I have no desire to lose our identity in order to pay Charismatics or Moderates to be our missionaries.
My hope is that all SB blogs will deal with the issues rather than personalities or conspiracy-theories. With that in mind we will soon begin our look into the issue of Baptism.
BR
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47 comments:
I am impressed when Southern Baptists bloggers that make assertions as if they were fact, then are proven wrong, humbly acknowledge their error.
A middle eastern missionary asks you on your previous post (seventh comment down) "if it is discovered that the account on Burleson's blog is accurate (see here, will you be working to resolve the injustice?
That is a good question. Sometimes we Southern Baptists lose sight of those who have been hurt for the sake of our ideology. We have established a fund to help Sheri Klouda and her family through this difficult financial time, and I would encourage you and your readers to assist. Graced people have soft hearts.
In His Grace,
Wade
P.S. I placed this comment on two comment strings. Thanks, Brad, for your posting them both.
Wade
Thanks for your efforts for Dr. Klouda, I am confident God will bless you.
Let me also state, that many times people get hurt when we post irresponsible implications which are erroneous.
Have a great day.
BR
Brad: Does it really take a prophet to predict inevitable outcomes from others actions? I think of "you reap what you sow". And back to my favorite Proverb on the subject. "He who troubles his own house will inherit the wind..."(11:29a
I rest in verse 12:14, "A man will be satisfied with good by the fruit of his words, and the deed of a man's hands will return to him." Jesus warns us, "judge not that ye be judged."
[Disclaimer: My comment is in no way directed at any one individual, I am responding to my take on the content within your post. I do not want my words to be misconstrued as many who comment have been.]
God bless you and your wife,as you enjoy God's gifts to you. SelahV
P.S. everyone, please continue to remember Rex's brother in prayer.
Wade
Thanks for dropping by again also.
Let me recommend something to you, if I may. I was very encouraged by Bart Barber's latest post on his blog...perhaps it may be an encouragement to you also.
God Bless You my brother
BR
Selah
Thank you again for your words and also for your Christian care. We will continue to pray.
BR
Wade,
Can you point interested parties to where they might find out more about the fund for Dr. Klouda? Also, I wonder if something can be set up through Paypal or similar 'online' payment system to make getting funds to her and her family easier?
Grace to you brother,
PTL
Bubba
You and I see eye to eye on many things, but I always seem to be asking you to be more kind.
You have great insights, but I think you can post your comment without questioning if others sympathy or humility is genuine.
I am as confident as you that political activity is not dormant, but I fear you crossed the line. I think your heart is pure and you mean well but please help me in maintaining a Christian spirit here. While I am not questioning your motives I fear you leave yourself open for others to.
Please reword your comment without questioning the sincerity of others and I will gladly post it.
God Bless you my brother
BR
Wade: I for one feel Dr. Klouda has been placed on a billboard for which she does not deserve.
I remember when I was "fired" from a job, NOT because I was negligent in my duties, nor incompetent in any way, shape or form. I was fired because my boss was a New Age believer, practicing his beliefs and forcing employees to adhere to his philosophy and system of thought. His exact response to my question of why he was firing me was this, "It's a gut feeling." He did give me a choice. I could resign and he would give me great recommendations, or he would fire me and he'd not support me in anyway should I use him as a reference.
Fortunately, I was able to collect unemployment because he wrongfully fired me. It put our family in dire straits. Soon after, my husband's position as pastor over a mission church was eliminated because, in the words of the Senior Pastor of the First Baptist Church which ruled over the mission church, "It's just politics." The politics was because I gave a testimony in our church which some folks didn't like. C'est la vie.
We lost our home and it scarred my adult daughter and teenage son for years. While we had faith that carried us through the dark period of our lives, our children processed the situation with horrible consequences to their spiritual assessment of "Christians".
I was told by an attorney that both my husband and I had legal positions in which we could pursue monetary compensation. I envisioned me on the Phil Donohue show sharing why I was suing because I was discriminated against because I was a Christian. (Wouldn't that have been a landmark case in court?)
We chose to move on trusting in the Lord for His deliverance and for His justice. We were without a church for over 6 months. I could not get a job because every time I referenced my last job, the dentist I worked for slandered me and told prospective employers that I was "not a team player." My co-workers were mortified. My husband could get no help from secular agencies such as unemployment because he was a self-employed minister. He couldn't even get a job as a hamburger flipper because all prospective employers saw him as a man who would leave their employment as soon as he got another church. They did not want to waste their time and money in training him to flip hamburgers.
I finally had an opportunity in a Radio Station to be a copywriter and my freelance writing skills fit perfectly for the position. But the employer saw that I was a minister's wife and didn't want to employ me because as soon as my husband got a church, I'd leave.
Through it all, we learned to trust in Jesus. Our first church helped us with food. The KY Baptist Convention gave us 400 a month toward our rent. It was a dark dark time for us.
I feel blessed that we never went public with all that occurred. We watched the Senior Pastor eventually lose his church. The historic church burned down. The education minister was fired for homosexual behavior. To my knowledge the dentist who fired me because I didn't denounce my faith in Jesus and adhere to his beliefs is still in business.
I'm so glad our family wasn't placed in the newspaper as the sacrificial lamb for change. I'm so glad there were no such things as blogs or public forums for discussing us and dissecting all that occurred. It could have been so distorted. And we simply didn't have the energy or spirit in which to respond to anyone in the matters. We were so broken by it all. We never questioned God. We questioned so-called Christian people. We wondered where our brothers and sisters were. We wondered why the people in the FBC church which knew what had occurred didn't at least take up an offering for us.
I'm glad you are doing what you can financially to support Dr. Klouda. But I am glad no one let the whole world know of our needs at the time. I'm grateful that in a quiet simple way, the Lord provided for our needs. We learned better what sacrifice means. We learned to be content with and without.
My heart goes out to all involved in this public discussion of Christian brothers and sisters. It is heartrending to me. I feel their pain. I know the heartache of their families who have absolutely nothing to do with all this. I pray for Christ's protection upon the children and grandchildren who are witnessing this.
It is sad that in 2000 years we have learned so little. Very sad, indeed. SelahV
Selah,
What a testimony God has given you for how those who depend on him are sustained through dark times. I, too, wish that individual personalities did not have to be paraded through the blogworld and secular press, but I'm afraid that, in this case, it would have been self-defeating had those who called attention to the alleged improprieties remained vague and ambiguous regarding the identity of Dr. Klouda.
There does appear to be more and more substance to the allegation that Dr. Klouda was granted tenure track by the SWBTS board of trustees and then was revoked her tenure by Dr. Patterson based solely on her gender - and that after an alleged affirmation by Dr. Patterson that Dr. Klouda's position was 'safe'. If such was the case, sb's should be aware of the current administrator's actions - we've already agreed how sad it is that it is 'secular' fodder as well - so that the 'owners' of the seminaries (i.e. member sb churches) may know of what their delegated leaders are doing. It is then the obligation of member sb churches to reinforce Dr. Patterson's choices or to voice disapproval.
At least that's how I see the system working in light of the fact that the information had not been divulged by other (some would say 'appropriate') channels. It is obvious that, had certain individuals not made public these alleged actions, the trustees - for whatever reasons - were not nearly so eager to divulge these occurences to the member/owners of SWBTS. To God be the glory that all things that happen HE allows to happen FOR HIS glory. :)
Grace to you sister,
PTL
To All:
I think most can easily connect the dots concerning some assumptions made on this string, but for those who cannot, allow me to shed more light; as truth enjoys light.
1. The article cited in the ABP is in the ABP. For those not familiar: the ABP is not the BP. The BP is largely funded by the SBC; the ABP is not funded at all by the convention but is largely funded by the CBF. The CBF is no friend of Dr. Paige Patterson’s.
2. The assumptions that some appear to be making, is that Dr. Klouda’s statement as reported by the ABP, that “information chronicled” on some blogs is “reliable” means that she personally believes is no error in the information (whether the assumption is correct or not can only be answered by Dr. Klouda)…further the very article itself states that SW officials claim that the same blog as referenced by Dr. Klouda contained “unspecified “inaccuracies””
Now, while I am gullible, I did not just fall off the turnip truck. To assume that a former employee’s recollection of the events is totally correct and that the employer’s recollection is totally incorrect demands a lot of faith. Any pastor or employer who has had the sad duty of either releasing or not extending an employee’s contract knows very well that the employee’s story will differ from the employer’s story.
Currently, what we have to go on, is the word of the ABP and some bloggers or the word of SW officials. As for me, I will tend to side with a SBC institution rather than CBF supported institutions.
PTL,
If you are really searching for truth I am sure you will find it. But blogs and newspapers do not make things true, so you are incorrect about the assumption you made in your comment to Selah. Perhaps we would be wise to allow the legal groups who are being called in to make judgments before we rush to them.
BR
Brad,
I think you'll notice, if you read back through my comments, that I've made no allegations. I have, however, stated that 'if the allegations are found to be true', then we all, as sb's have certain obligations. I have also contended, I think you'll agree, that if the allegations are false, I've expressed strong dismay toward those who have made these charges.
You have correctly surmised that it is rash to assume - without concrete evidence - that Dr. Klouda's version is accurate. Consistency demands, however, that you issue the same hesitancy toward those who have been accused, no?
I believe that, in this specific situation, the objective observer - which I believe myself to be as I have no interest AT ALL in any political maneuvers against Dr. Patterson, nor do I hold any special affinity for Dr. Patterson which may or may not cloud my judgement - would say there appears to be relevance to the allegations.
Having said that, however, I agree with you in that I am sure the legal groups will be able to sort through it all and help us understand what, if anything, has happened.
Our search should always be for the truth - a truth not clouded by political agenda or personal affiliation.
peace to you my brother,
PTL
Selahv,
That is a tremendous testimony ot the grace of God bringing your family and yourselves through some tough times.
2Cor 12 immediately springs to mind But He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for poweris perfected in weakness.” Therefore, I will most gladly boast all the more about my weaknesses, so that Christ’s power may reside in me.
10 So because of Christ, I am pleased in weaknesses, in insults, in catastrophes, in persecutions, and in pressures. For when I am weak, then I am strong.
It is amazing how we can look back and see what the Lord taught us in the pressure cooker.
I love Warren Weirsbe's statement.. when you are in the pressure cooker, the Lord's eye is on the thermometer and His hand is on the thermostat.
Steve
Brad,
You said:
further the very article itself states that SW officials claim that the same blog as referenced by Dr. Klouda contained “unspecified “inaccuracies"
The inaccuracies were listed by Dr Van Mclain in his correspondence with Burleson. He simply stated that the board vote when hiring Dr Klouda was not unanimous. Based on Burleson's blog date January 26, it seems that we will all be waiting for some time to see these minutes. But it seems like a somewhat insignificant discrepancy in light of the rest of the information that Burleson published.
You also stated:
Currently, what we have to go on, is the word of the ABP and some bloggers or the word of SW officials.
What concerns me in this situation is that the only part of Burleson's blog they are disputing is that the board vote wasn't unanimous. The implication is that the rest of what is written there is true ... this greatly arouses my sense of justice. It seems to me that Burleson is doing what he can to right this wrong (both in assisting the Klouda family financially & bringing this situation to the attention of those of us who would be otherwise uniformed) ... and I am certainly appreciative on both counts!
May His face shine upon you,
from the Middle East
PTL and Middle East
Thank you both for your concerns for the SBC...but allow me to quote again what sbcpastor brought to our attention:
"I find it “curious,” as do others, that Hodge’s article in the Dallas Morning News makes no mention of your “assertion” that Dr. Patterson gave assurance to Dr. Klouda that she would be granted tenure. Are you saying, in your post, that Klouda told you that he personally gave her assurance that she would be granted tenure? Or, is there a link to an article that you can provide for us stating that he did so?
Clearly, the Baptist Press article – the one that you referred to in your post – says no such thing. In fact, it clearly states the opposite of that which you claim:
“Patterson was asked whether he would allow a woman to teach in the seminary’s school of theology. Noting that his wife, Dorothy, had served on the faculty at Southeastern Seminary teaching in the women’s studies program she developed within the division of theology, Patterson said that information provided ‘something of an answer.’ Earlier, the board unanimously elected her as a full professor without pay while having faculty benefits.
‘It would not be my purpose as a leader to do anything in the school of theology that would be something other than what I would want our churches to imitate.’ Expecting that ‘there are ample numbers of men who are well-qualified for those positions,’ Patterson said he plans to build the faculty with ‘God-called men.’ He said opportunities arise for women to teach in the areas of Christian education, ministry to women and children as well as music ministry.”"
Perhaps this sheds more light on some of the inaccuracies that the admin believe occur. Further, I think we all know that the admin has not commented on this; so again I feel more comfortable trusting an SBC institution than a CBF supported institution or a blog whose operator has clearly been less than honest on this blog (claiming I did not post his comments and then when confronted to prove his assertion, claimed he forgot what they were - everyone here knows I post all comments - I gave him opportunities to clarify his misunderstanding but he continued to be less than honest - this type of behavior causes one to wonder what other things he may state which may be misleading; and yet I have no doubt he is a good man who loves our Lord).
BR
Brad: In case anyone is interested, my comments have been directed to the "way" in which this has been publicized. Not any specific person or side of the issue.
With the news background I have (as explained earlier on the previous thread of conversations) I am now, not only saddened by what I'm reading, but further suspicious of the sources of information. Thus the credibility of alleged assertions is in further question.
I just pray that parties involved are not so boxed into a corner by their champions that the truth will forever be skewed. I bow to your last statement to PTL of who owns what paper and who has what to gain from it.
PTL: I completely understand how you may fall on the side of this issue. I realize you just want right to be right and wronged to be righted, and truth to be known. I appreciate you for that.
However, look back at what you just wrote to me: "There does appear to be more and more substance to the allegation that Dr. Klouda was granted tenure track by the SWBTS board of trustees and then was revoked her tenure by Dr. Patterson based solely on her gender - and that after an alleged affirmation by Dr. Patterson that Dr. Klouda's position was 'safe'."
Operative words in your comment are "Appear to be", "allegation", "alleged affirmation by Dr. Patterson".
Until this has been played out, (and now I "assume" it will be quite publically) I still see no reasons to reverse what I've held to all along. I don't know. You don't know. We don't know. ABP doesn't know. Dallas News doesn't know. BP doesn't know. Bloggers don't know. Only Dr. Patterson and Dr. Klouda "know" the nuts and bolts of what occurred. And as Brad very pointedly placed on the table, views and interpretations can be poles apart in conversations. Communication of intents and motives can be completely correct, AND totally honorable, from BOTH person's perspectives as they recall conversation. But "believed" intents and motives is not what anyone should nail to a cross at the moment.
The crowd believed they were right. The pharisees believed they were justified. We believed we'd never been all that bad. Adam blamed Eve, and Eve blamed the serpent. And the serpent blamed God. And a perfectly innocent Saviour died to finish the blame game.
And maybe "very sad" is too weak a description for how I see this mess. Let's just say I'm glad I'm not God. Very very glad.
Blessings brothers and sisters!
I continue to remain unbiased in the matter. To date, everything has been pure speculation. I imagine "evidence" will be presented at some later date. Or maybe compensation will be arrived at to make the situation "at hand" go away. Or maybe the Lord will remove the tares whom He sees as causing the worst offense. Or maybe He will just give us all up to our own way and wash His hands of the whole sordid mess.
"satan's like a roaring lion, traveling to and fro, seeking whom he may devour. But greater is He Who is in me than he who is in the world."
Anyone pray for our military lately? Our church has several fellas over there. I live in an Army town and 35 miles from an Airforce base. Can we pray for some peace...somewhere? SelahV
Selah
I haven't prayed for our military since Monday (that is the day I pray for local, state and federal leaders by name). Thanks for the reminder.
BR
Steve: Sure wish this pressure cooker would be like my grandma's. Hers use to get them beans done in ten minutes versus an hour of boilin' time. don't think I've ever been out of the cooker since the Good Lord jumped into my heart and saved my soul.
PTL: while I was typing my comment to Brad and you earlier, you posted yours to Brad saying you weren't on any side of the issue. I'm sorry if I saw you as so. Guess our only divide is that this has to play out to get to some truth necessary for all the spectators. I wish the parties involved could all go into a room together, and come out and smile to the public and say, "resolved, restored, forgiven, forgotten." And I wish the public would be left in the blasted dark until God reveals what He wants revealed in glory. But I'm just a dumb pollyanna who wants everyone to kiss and make up.
However, I dare say many in the court of public opinion would not rest till they knew every detail of the reconciliation process so they could cheer and break their arms patting their backs over the outcome. Even the United States Department of Defense can't keep anything secret. And news folk seem to think every burp and expression of air is their responsibility to report to the world. So I guess I can forget about my Pollyanna dreams. SelahV
Selah,
I'm sure you've thought through your analogy to the Pharisees, but I am often frightened by how much we all are more like the Pharisees than we'd like to think. It is a frightening thought that most of us probably would have sided with the Pharisees if placed in their position. Scary, no? May God abase those who attempt to thwart Him and may He 'make the paths straight' of those who honestly seek the truth.
Peace sister,
PTL
Brad,
Considering all of the misunderstandings that seem to be out there right now, I think it is definitely wise to refrain from burning anyone at the stake just yet. ;) However, I continue to commend Burleson, on this one, for working towards righting what, if his report is true (so far SWBTS refuses to officially challenge any portion of the content of his blog other than the unanimous board vote), is quite an injustice committed towards one of our sisters. While the evidence, at this time, indicates his report is accurate ... I won't go on record until SWBTS makes a more informative statement.
I am actually quite grieved in writing this portion of my comment. A statement you made disappointed me greatly & I feel that it is necessary to bring your attention to it. Please do not take this as an attack, as it is certainly not meant that way. You said:
this type of behavior causes one to wonder what other things he may state which may be misleading; and yet I have no doubt he is a good man who loves our Lord
Let me rephrase this & maybe you will see why I am disappointed in your statement:
Based on his previous behavior he is a liar and this makes me wonder if he is lying to us now, but I am sure that he is a good man & loves the our Lord.
Apologies are in order, or he is not a good man in which case you should retract the second portion of your statement. That is, unless your definition of a good man includes being a liar ... and knowing your stance on holiness I am pretty sure it doesn't. ;) Again, this is not an attack, but there is some inconsistency in your statement & I felt it warranted some reflection. If you did not mean it this way, please forgive my mis-reading your words.
May His face shine upon you,
from the Middle East
PTL: Absolutely! I totally agree! (Disclaimer: I think. If you are saying what I think you are saying. THEN I agree. :)))) SelahV
Middle East
You may state it how you wish. The point is he claimed I did not publish his comments when he knows full well, I did. When confronted and given an opportunity to correct it, he maintained his claim. For me this error does not make him a bad man...it does cause me to not be so quick to trust his statements, but it does not make him a bad man.
I have a difficult time calling children of the living God something other than good. I further have a difficult time calling a pastor who has given his life to serving God something other than good. Obviously, his latest efforts on behalf of Dr. Klouda reveal his goodness, but that does not mean there are no errors he commits.
For example he started this comment string with this statement: "I am impressed when Southern Baptists bloggers that make assertions as if they were fact, then are proven wrong, humbly acknowledge their error." knowing full well he was less than honest with his accusations of me.
Nevertheless, I return to my thesis, which is: just because He is a man who loves God does not mean he is flawless. In fact, were we to compare sins I fear I will be on the losing side with most all who read this.
BR
Selah,
It is what you think I'm saying. :)
have a peaceful evening,
PTL
PTL
Allow me to concur with Selah here, I think we are all agreed on this one:)
BR
Brad,
Brad,
In one place you say,
"God Bless You my brother"
but in another you state,
"Let me also state, that many times people get hurt when we post irresponsible implications which are erroneous."
Will you please prove that the post is "irresponsible?" Will you please prove that the posts were "erroneous?"
It is easy to throw out accusations without supportint them. You have lost integrity if you do not address what exactly is erroneous. If you choose not to do so, then you should retract your accusation.
TC
TC
I was just making a general statement. I never accused anyone of anything.
But the fact you confronted me about specific citations of a general statement (which I think you will agree with) and not others about specific examples of their general statement (nor even the irony of the statement) is most telling.
By the way, for the record, I agree with the other general statement
BR
Brad,
Two questions:
What legitimate reason could there be for Van McClain to take action to stop the release of the minutes of the meeting where the vote was taken regarding Dr. Klouda since: 1) minutes of the public session of trustee meetings are normally available upon written request; 2) the vote tally is the only specific claim in Wade Burleson's blog that Van McClain, after being challenged on his statement that the blog is "filled with inaccuracies" has challenged, and; 3) the minutes will back up his claim if he is correct? I am not stating or aware that Van McClain has or plans to take such action - only want to know from you - based on your perpective - if there could be any legitimate reason such action might be taken, especially since the meeting minutes are the one item that would allow us to confirm his assertion.
Is there anything Paige Patterson, Van McClain, and/or the SWBTS could do that could cause you to doubt their veracity?
Brad: I will tell you what I told others who make such predictions. First of all thanks because that is exactly what I would say is going on. It saves me from having to say it. You may disagree, but what happened to Dr. Klouda was wrong. I am glad it was brought to light. Second: You could give to Dr. Klouda yourself, a soft heart and compassion for one who is hurting, helping where we can is because of our heart of flesh(Ezekiel) that God gives us.
Greg
Excellent questions. But I have tried to never make assumptions or theorize why others may have done something (I am sure I fail at times, but that is my goal).
I know Dr. Patterson on a personal level - not just what blogs or CBF funded news sources say...and I trust him. However, my closest friends in all the world will tell you my loyalty lies in Christ and thus in Truth. Therefore, I think you have your answer.
However, may I pose the same question to you my brother? Since I have shown a lack of veracity by some bloggers and have clearly evidenced it (not a he said/she said argument which has no evidence); is there anything, which could cause you to doubt the veracity of what some bloggers say?
Truth is what we are searching for my brother and I will be the first to state we all have presuppositions from which we operate...the goal is to try and be aware of our presuppositions and to try and keep them from blinding us to truth.
Be blessed my brother
BR
Debbie,
Thanks for your words of encouragement in giving. I can always use them. I remember being challenged by students from SE while we were in India (Se has great students) to give the very clothes we took with us, to ones on the street who literally did not know where their next meal was coming from (they slept on the dirt streets (they have no shelters or food pantries where we went in India)).
It is good to be challenged to give and I have also found we can never outgive God. My wife and I gladly affirm we obey Christ in the matter of tithing (to the local church) but we also gladly give above the tithe to other ministries for He is a Great God and worthy of all we have and so much more and it is a joy to give to Him.
However, it has always been our practice to not tell others what or to whom we give, (other than to affirm we are obediant to Christ) for two reasons. First, I would want others to recognize it came from Christ not from us therefore I prefer to give anonymously; Second I have a hard enough time battling my pride.
But thank you for your encouragement and I might add that anyone who does not give to the poor is not exhibiting the spirit of Christ.
Which reminds me, I have a close friend who has a ministry in India where he provides clothes, shelter (Christian environment), schoolbooks and food to orphans. He also has a school which trains native pastors. If anyone is interested you can e-mail me and I can send you information.
BR
Brad: I also have had my predictions come true. In spades.
Brad: I certainly agree with giving to the poor and those in need. There are many countries that could use our help. We are also to help each other in our time of need. That's part of being in a family. In fact James says that is why we go through trials(James 1) in order to equip us to comfort others. The poor are important and being their for one of our own is equally important.
Brad,
When two people tell contradictory stories about the same thing, one is telling the truth and one is lying, or both are lying, but both are not telling the truth.
When the whole IMB trustee thing came up, what Wade said and what the former chairman Tom Hatley said were irreconcilably two different stories. Over time, we learned that Tom Hatley's statements were false, while everything Wade said stood up.
This time, the SWBTS chairman has made statements that are already demonstrably untrue. For example, you cannot say Wade's blog was "filled with inaccuracies" but when asked for specifics about what is inaccurate, respond with one relatively immaterial item ("the vote (by the trustees regarding Dr. Klouda) was not unanimous"). Then, when the record (meeting transcripts) that will validate this very point is requested, refuse to provide it.
We've seen this all before, now multiple times.
I guess my question for you, Brad, is how many times do you have to see it before you figure out who is telling the truth?
Debbie
You are Right ON!!!
There are plenty of poor and plenty of brothers/sisters in Christ who can benefit from the blessings God has given us to give to others. May we all be doing so. Let me state I personally think one should take care of one's family first in these areas and then those in the church where one's membership is and then to the rest of our brothers/sisters in Christ and the world as God leads.
I fear what many Christians may fail to get is, its not our pocketbook...it's God's
BR
Greg
You need look no further than this string of comments for evidence of inaccuracies by bloggers (I think I have shown that).
Further, you may want go back and read my posts from September concerning IMB.
Thus, again my friend perhaps the inconsistencies you see in me may just be a speck in your brothers eye.
BR
Brad,
As you know there have been times when we both have disagreed with Wade very strongly.
In this situation I really do call on you to respond to the question he addresses toward you in the very first comment on this comment thread in a very direct manner.
My brother, to answer this particular question in a direct, honest and transparent mannner is the only right thing to do.
If Wade is right, we should all work to see this thing resolved in a righteous manner.
If Wade is lying he should publicly apologize to everyone involved.
He has placed his honor and reputation before his family, his church, his peers, and the whole world relating to this situation. Most of all he stands in the presence of God with all he has said. If he is wrong he must apologize or loose his honor and stand guilty before a holy God.
If he is right, we must help to right this wrong.
With all my heart, I ask you to give a direct and transparent answer to the question: "IF IT IS DISCOVERED THAT THE ACCOUNT ON BURLESON'S BLOG IS ACCURATE, WILL YOU BE WORKING TO RESOLVE THE INJUSTICE?"
If not, why not?
cb
Brad, so we can count on you then? :)
Hey Brad: I need a root canal and a crown. It's gonna cost 1,400 hundred. My husband needs one too. He's gonna wait and just have it pulled. My 1994 Van needs brakes, shocks, an exhaust system, a new air-conditioner (been without one for two years now). I'd like to go see my dad in East Tennessee because he is in early stages of renal failure, I need 3,700.00 to pay off my son's funeral bill-- which come May will be two years of indebtedness to the kind directors of the funeral home. My husband's mom is down to 78 pounds and I just scraped together enough to get him a ticket to go see her in Florida. I should have had some expensive test on my heart last summer, but without insurance, and without a bunch of money up-front they won't do the test. Preliminary difficulties with my eyesight is suggesting macular degeneration like my dad has.
Life is not great. But my future is bright. God is my refuge. And His grace is sufficient.
Don't take up any money for me. Don't send any checks. My Savior says not to worry. He says to ask of the Father, "give us this day our daily needs". I do and He does. Don't know why. I sure don't deserve it. It may have something to do with trusting in Him and not leaning on my own understanding. Then it may just be He enjoys watching me react in patience when the burner goes out on my stove and I give my grocery money to help someone else because He prompts me to do so. I don't know.
All I know is I love what you said about not telling others what to do with the money God has entrusted to them. I love it when God urges me to give and it's impossible for me to do so and when I obey, He blesses me in ways I cannot believe. It's so neat not to be on a guilt-trip all the time about what to do as a Christian. I love Jesus. He's so real.
A friend of mine cleaned out her closet this week and I have some brand new skirts. Isn't that cool? God bless you, Brad. And yes, I'd like information about your friend in India. I'm sure I can find something else I don't need to eat next week. SelahV
Brad,
What is your take on this Associated Press article?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16828466/
May His face shine upon you,
from the Middle East
CB
Concerning your question let me say that, even if one felt a wrong is done by a brother in the convention I must agree with Selah, I don’t feel public blogs are the way to handle it, nor do I think God is honored by such displays.
Further, I would never presume to take the responsibilities God has given to the Trustees.
BR
Debbie,
I am confident you would never ask me to do something which goes against my convictions. And since I believe I should not tell publicly who and how much God leads us to give, I know you will not ask me to share…but thank you for your concern for me my sister.
BR
Selah,
I will e-mail you the information and some questions I have for some situations you mentioned. The pastors in India are also our brothers in Christ who are in need. Please know I am grateful for your kind spirit and I will be praying for you. I know you are Godly and I have never seen the righteous forsaken.
When we were growing up, you could say we were poor by American standards. We had electricity turned off, phone disconnected, foreclosure threatened (God sent us $3000 in the mail one day – the exact amount needed to pay the bank 2 days later of else foreclosure) etc. But my mother faithfully tithed and trusted God and although many nights we had just potatoes, gravy and bread to eat God always provided.
I will be praying for you and I know God will bless you.
BR
Middle East
No new news here.
Please refer to my 4:35 PM comment as of yesterday.
BR
Pastor Brad,
Where would we be today if it were not for men like Martin Luther?
Shining the light of truth on what goes on behind closed doors of institutions has changed the world.
In like type, SWBTS is the Vatican and Burleson is Luther.
Bubba Bear says that Burleson and Cole are tearing down one of Gods servants. I dont see it. What I do see is a man that has set himself up for failure.
Keeping any institution that is within the SBC as a good ol boy network will not work in this day.
The truth is out, and it has set us free.
David,
Thank you for being so transparent with your presuppositions, my brother.
We certainly agree about the freeing of Truth
BR
Brad: thanks for the information on the ministry in India. I've always wanted to give to something like that but have always been leary because so much of what is given to ministries these days goes to administration costs. Which is why I've loved our Lottie Moon and Annie Armstrong Offerings in the SBC. All that money goes directly to help missionaries in the field. And that of course wouldn't be possible if not for cooperating churches sending in their gifts to the Cooperative Program. Lord I wish folks would take a few steps back and see our beloved Convention through the eyes of God.
I see you've moved on to a new post. Think I'll head on up there and see what ya got cooking. Thanks for your kind words and your generous spirit. May God multiply to you a million times the heart you have for others. SelahV
Selah
I don't know of any greater ministry I can give to than the CP and the Lottie Moon and Annie Armstrong offerings. Fortunately, God allows us to give to others, but those 3 are priorities for us.
BR
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