Saturday, September 30, 2006

Here I Stand...Redeemed

Not long ago on another Blog I engaged a young man who spewed forth slanderous implications towards Dr. Patterson as an erupting volcano spews forth molten lava (and he made it clear to me, as I cautioned him of his path, that he has no intention of stopping – so be it, SB will see it for what it is). Well, I am not easily roused, but I was that evening. Retrospectively, I began a self-evaluation to determine the stimulus behind my passion. What fueled the flame that burned so brightly that evening? At first, I thought that it was this young man’s singling out Dr. Patterson as the root of all evil in SBC life, rather than gratefully acknowledging him as an impetus that has helped to remove universalism from our seminaries.

Why was Dr. Patterson the only institutional head singled out? Calling for investigative questions and postulating erroneous implications concerning the use of funds, etc. Why was SW Seminary the only institution he called out for such an investigation…not the IMB, not the executive committee, not any of our other institutions (I have no doubt all of our institutional heads seek to be above reproach in fiscal stewardship, frugality, responsibility, and personal integrity…I was just shocked at the singling out of one man). However, the more I thought about his comments, the more I realized this wasn’t the reason I reacted so ardently.

I began to believe I was aroused because it was an unsolicited drive-by against a Man of God. And yet, as valid of a concern as that was, as I searched deeper I realized this was not the primary motive behind my fire either.

Thus, I contemplated whether I was angered at the outright deceptiveness of it. While that certainly troubled me, it too failed to be the genesis of my response.

Finally, I thought my emotions were a result of the lack of confrontation he received from others. Men, who signed the Memphis Declaration, promising to confront such speech, certainly did not on that blog. I even asked the administrator to, but received silence. Yet, in reality that wasn’t even the origin of my frustrations.

Actually and confessionally, what moved my spirit the most was the knowledge of my own wickedness. I realized, even if there was a tiny element of truth in anything the young man said, my sins far outweighed his accusations of Dr. Patterson.

I knew my wretchedness reached deeper than any depth the leaders of our institutions may have traversed in their humanity. Evil thoughts I have had, impure motives I have entertained, unchaste speech I have used, and unholy actions I have committed reek of shameful odors. What if this young man were privy to my private thoughts? What if this young man blogged my sinful actions to the world with unrestrained and undocumented license? Talk about embarrassing!

As I dwelt on these thoughts an incredibly beautiful Word sprang forth in my mind: GONE.

Gone, my sins are gone…removed by the BLOOD OF JESUS!!!

Even if man (the created ones) knew of all my sins…even if Satan spewed them forth as the Great Accuser that he is. Even if I were laid bare before all creation, there is a joy, which overshadows my shame. For man is but dust, but the CREATOR, the Omniscient One, The Ancient of Days, The I AM, Existence and LIFE HIMSELF sees no sin in me. My filth was laid upon Christ and is removed. I AM CLEAN – FOREVER.

And quite frankly, that’s all that matter’s. So, if there are any who would speak evil of me, so be it (this will keep their time consumed from speaking of others). But as far as I, and my Creator are concerned, my sins are gone. Here I Stand…Redeemed by the blood of the Lamb.
BR


UPDATES:

1. Florida Baptist Witness posted a new article on the Joshua Convergence Friday, Sept. 28.

2. I am currently on my way to El Salvador. I would appreciate your prayers for the group from SE (35 of us). Also, please keep my wife in your prayers as she is staying home with our soon to be baby boy:)

3. Dr. Jerry Vines will begin a series of message this Sunday night at FBC Woodstock, which will deal with current Baptist issues. He has titled his series Baptist Battles and it will include: 1. LIBERALISM: A Baptist and his Bible; 2. CALVINISM: A Baptist and his election; 3. PENTECOSTALISM: A Baptist and his gifts; and 4. LIBERTINISM: A Baptist and his Booze. You can avail yourself of this series through www.jerryvines.com

4. I don’t know when I will be able to check the comments…so please keep a Christlike spirit (I certainly have no desire to remove comments).

5. HOOK ‘EM HORNS:)

93 comments:

Les Puryear said...

Brad,

May God bless and protect you as you seek to minister in El Salvador. May your wife be surrounded by the protection of God as she awaits her delivery of God's new creation in God's perfect timing.

Many regards,

Les

Kevin Holmes (and still baptist by conviction) said...

Brad,

I appreciate your sentiment. I agree that we do indeed owe the architects of the conservative resurgence a debt of gratitude.

However, I have seen, and continue to see personal attacks by those on both sides of the isle in the SBC. I have seen attacks against the "conservatives" on "moderate" blogs that went uncontested. I have seen attacks against the "moderates" on "conservative" blog sites that went uncontested. I'm sure I'm guilty as well.

We all need to turn the accusing finger inward rather than outward. We need to turn the directing finger to Jesus rather than to any man.

I have more thoughts on this in my own blog (www.anewresurgence.blogspot.com)if you care to read.

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Wayne Smith In His Name said...

All

How can we Southern Baptist have Seminary Presidents and Professors that have a Theology where they don't believe or teach the Doctrine of Predestination or Doctrine of Election?
Are these Presidents and Professors not paid by CP money, which are Tithes given for God's Work and for God's Glory. All of this is in the Bible and covered by the Lamb's Book of life. .
I believe we need to start having some accountability in the SBC and would like to see a motion go forth at the next convention instead of the unbiblical traditions like alcohol use in our SBC.

In His Name

Wayne Smith In His Name said...

Based on some question and comments I wonder if some have their name in the Lamb's Book of Life written before the Foundation of the World, meaning before Creation.

In His Name

Anonymous said...

Wayne Smith,

Are you serious? If you are then you are a bigger kook than Wade. May God have mercy on you.

Jim Henry

peter lumpkins said...

Brothers,

Ummm...I thought Dr. Reynolds asked us to play nice while he was away...

Peace. With that, I am...

Peter

Wade Burleson said...

Bill Dickson,

For the fifth and final time, Frank Page is an excellent President and will be reelected in San Antonio. Your infatuation with McKissic would be funny if it weren't sad.

Terrence, your questions are an insult to anyone who names the name of Christ as Lord.

Wade Burleson said...
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Anonymous said...
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Wade Burleson said...

Mr. Jim Henry,

I think Wayne is simply asking why some seem to be so angry and bitter, which are two heart attitudes that typically do not characterize graced individuals.

By the way, my 12 year old son read your comment and I assured him that you are not the Jim Henry that we know, but for his sake I would like to ask you to define "kook" so he can know what you mean about his dad.

Thanks,

wade

brad reynolds said...

Hey Guys,

As Peter notes. Let's be kind.

By the way we are in San Salvador. 20 of us from SE joining a church from MS to share Christ this week. We are accompanied by interpreters from a local Baptist church.

Les,

Thank you for your kind words.


Bill

Wade has answered your questions many times now. Let's trust his word. Ben, however, has committed in a post, what he called and confronted me about, in a comment I made. Quite ironic.

He called me and confronted me about claiming to know (in a comment I made) the reason he was fired and then said I did not know the "reason" he was fired from SW because I had not seen the "personnel records," I agreed and even apologized (although the information I had, came from an individual he had told). Now he claims Patterson was fired for "alleged financial irregularities" - not only is that blatantly false but Dr. Patterson wasn't even fired. Talk about blinded by his sight.

His credibility continues to shrink with such accusations. However, he has posted a "cut" from my message at the JC. For that I am grateful. But he left out the important part about being separated to Christ. I don't understand why he left out the important part.
BR

CB Scott said...

Brad,

Button that coat:-)

cb

sbc pastor said...

Wayne (IHN),

Which SBC Presidents and Professors do not believe in the Biblical doctrines of predestination and election? I personally have attended Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary and Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary (not to mention Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary and have also taken a few classes online from the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary) and personally do not know of one single individual that does not hold to either of those Biblical doctrines. Thus, it may be profitable for you to verify your sources before making such unfounded comments. God bless!!!

In Christ,
JLG

Wayne Smith In His Name said...

SBC Pastor,

I think some speak out against anything that leans toward Calvinist or what John Calvin stood for. I know the Baptist Church was orginally was a Reformed Church until we fell away.

In His Name

sbc pastor said...

Wayne (IHN),

I still am waiting for your answer: Which SBC Presidents and Professors do not believe in the Biblical doctrines of predestination and election?

Thanks and God bless!!!

In Christ,
JLG

Kevin Bussey said...

Brad,

Blessings on your trip. I will pray for you.

peter lumpkins said...

Dear Brother Wayne,

I will probably post on my site soon some of John Calvin's words so perhaps more will note what he stood for. I think it will be interesting fodder.

May God our Savior give you all grace and power tomorrow as you faithfully preach His Word.

With that, I am...

Peter

Jeffro said...

Brad,

I have been out of pocket for a while, taking Dr. Welch's advice. I've been trying not to be one of those "bloggin' boys."

It was nice to actually see you post on something that has anything to do with the faith. For a while it seemed that you were only interested in "Guarding" the flock. The part of the flock that that can "guard" itself, such as Dr. Patterson, Dr. Vines, and the rest of his crowd (I mean no disrespect). The politcal whirlwind that has been swirling around since the convention is mind boggling. And, for the life of me, I can not figure out who keeps stirring the pot. Of course, Ben Cole is stirring the pot. He is always stirring the pot. I get the impression that he was stirring the pot in seminary. But what I don't understand is this. Why is everybody so worried about Ben and Wade? Honestly, "me thinks, thou dost protest too much."

On to bigger and better things. Who put the JC together? What was the motivation behind it? Is it or was it political? Can you answer, or will you have to "put your hand over your mouth?" :-)

An interested observer,
Jeff

brad reynolds said...

Kevin

Thanks my friend. I'll try and keep you posted from time to time.


Jeff
As for some of your comment I'll let the little shots go without response.

However, to answer your questions:
1. TJC was concieved in a meeting in Greensboro by 5 men. But what has generated the positive reception is that many others were thinking the same thoughts...IMHO I feel God was working in the hearts of many of us who were uncomfortable with what others our age were saying...simply put we wanted to work with like-minded men and women to speak for ourselves...To make a long answer short: I think God was working in numerous lives to put this Convergence together.

2, Nothing was hid...the motivation was to be open and state here is where we stand!

3. No political motivation behind it. No closed door meetings...no secret meetings...no meeting in a room privately and then releasing a press statement...a journalism from Florida Baptist Witness was at all the meetings and recorded all of it.

Hope this helps
BR

Bro. Robin said...

Brad

Great post! When I think of some of the things you expressed, I become quite humbled knowing what God did for me. But there is something that troubles me from some of the commentators.

As I have posted on my blog, I have not agreed with Wade on some of these issues. I have even been concerned with some things he has stated. I have even voiced my disappointments on his blog when others have trashed people like you, Dr. Patterson, or other leaders of our convention.

I am for the alcohol resolution, the PPL restriction, and the Baptism resolution from the IMB BOT. I even supported your sermon and comments made about Wade.

But guys, some of the comments made here are not in adherence with Christian respect for someone who was saved with the same blood that saved us.

If we want our ideas and vision to be heard, we must focus on issues rather than the person. I am for the occasional light heartedness, but these comments have not been light hearted. Guys we are better than this and Brad's blog deserves better from us in debating the issues.

I realize that I haven't been perfect in this on going electronic debate. So, I ask that all refrain from derogatory comments that have no base of Christian mercy, love, and conduct.

Brad, I thank you for defending the truth and I will pray while you are abroad carrying the good news.

God Bless

Bro. Robin

Anonymous said...

Wade,

I know that you have been generous in answering many questions. Yet you have failed to answer Terrence's question.

How is it that you can openly admit to the partaking of Wine and serve as a trustee? As I understand it, all IMB personnel have to sign a statement to have been free of alcohol for one year.

Why are you exempt?

Mallory Conway

brad reynolds said...

Robin

Wise words. Thank you. Let's disagree if we must but disagree on issues not on personalities - and do so in a Christlike Spirit.


Mallory and Terrence
I would Never ever presume to speak for Wade but I think he has answered your questions. The event of having a glass of wine occured before he was a Trustee. He has stated that he will gladly abstain now that he is a Trustee.

He and I still disagree on many things (more on that in the future) but let's be fair to him.

Hope this helps,
BR

Heading to church this morning. I love bi-lingual services. God is great.

Anonymous said...

Brad,

You need to read Wade's blog for Sunday Oct 1. He has strategically selected quotes from your blog that make him look like a poor defenceless puppy. This is nothing but a smokescreen to cover the truth. I think you have been slowly peeling away the facade of his unbiblical views and he is now attempting to rally support by making you look like a rumor monger.

It is working too. Some in his comment string even compare Wade to Jesus. One individual uses Tony Campola as an example of one who was also persecuted. I want to remind Wade that Tony Campola invited an openly Gay man into his classroom and affirmed that lifestyle as perfectly O.K.

Perhaps that says something about Wade and his intent to enlare the tent to include deviants from every walk of life. How large will we allow the tent to expand before it rips into?

Beware of the poor pitiful little whipped puppy.

Wade GROW UP and tell the truth. Let people know your true agenda.

You said that Jeremy Green did not allow comments. Well neither do you from anyone who does not have a blog site. Can you say hypocrite?

Lynn T. Boyd

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peter lumpkins said...

Dear Brother Terrence,

Is your question to Wade about his wife "pastoring" along with him really serious or are you being fecetious? And, know I am not being fecetious in asking.

With that, I am...

Peter

Jim said...

Bro Robin,

I agree with your statments about Christian charity in these discussions. Thanks for them.

I would also say that we should avoid errors in logic. For instance, Mr. Lynn Boyd ends up suggesting that Wade affirms a homosexual lifestyle, while not explicitly stating so.

Here's the logic he uses:
1) Some Wade supporters have equated him with Tony Campolo.
2) Tony Campolo invited a gay man to his classroom and affirmed the lifestyle (which may be true, but Lynn provides no evidence).
3) Therefore, Wade must be affirming of the homosexual lifestyle and include open and affirming churches in the SBC.

Did I miss something? That logic doesn't fly.

Friends, I repeat Bro. Robin's encouragement to deal with one another in love... which includes being intellectually honest in our discussions.

For God's Glory,

Jim

brad reynolds said...

Lynn

Thanks for the heads up. Wade fails to mention the names I was called on his blog months ago.

He also told me on the phone Thursday he was going to post something about "comments on my blog" but TOLD ME HE WOULD STATE the quotes do not reflect my attitude. Further, he failed to share how often I dissuade individuals from harsh langugae, a courtesy he did not extend to me.

Perhaps he forgot he told me that, but if not it sure begs integrity questions.

I will probably post again later this week on "Blinded by our sight - part 2:)
BR

Wade Burleson said...
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Wade Burleson said...

Brad,

I would be happy to place on my blog a statement that the comments I posted today do not reflect your feelings if you tell me that they don't.

The post to which you refer where I said I would issue a statement that the comments do not reflect your views has not yet been published. They were comments that dealt with an issue that we discussed over the phone, that after our conversation, I determined not to post (instead I posted my message on "Stumbling Stones").

I hope that answers your questions. By the way, I do not recall any comments where you were called a name, but if there exists one, those comments would be totally contrary to what I feel about you, and I would immediately, and gladly, remove it if you would point it out to me. I do not moderate comments and as soon as somebody writes something it is posted, as is the case on your blog.

Hope you have a great trip.

In His Grace,

Wade

brad reynolds said...

Wade
I will post them soon as well as the comments made about me on my blog. The nature of blogging is such that comments are made and we just take it. I'm ok with that, my friend encourage others to be kind and then let that which is said wrongly of you pass, the best you can.
BR

brad reynolds said...

To All
We had two teams go out tonight. I'm not sure how the second team did. But our team saw 30 professions of faith. 30!

Praise the Lord. I don't want to mention names but please keep 2 teenage girls and a teenage boy in your prayers I had the privilege of sharing Christ with them and they were saved.

I'll keep you posted.
BR

sbc pastor said...
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sbc pastor said...

Brad,

I find it rather ironic that Wade Burleson’s recent post about those attempting to “distract” attention away from the “issues” appears to be in itself an attempt to distract attention away from the REAL issues – such as several statements that he, a Trustee of the IMB, has recently made:

1) He admittedly signed the BF&M with “a couple of written caveats.”

NOTE: A “caveat” is a modifying detail; a stipulation or a provision which clearly denotes that one’s affirmation is conditional and therefore NOT in complete agreement with as written. Interestingly, the Latin “cavere” means “warning” or more literally “let him beware.” This would seemingly be an appropriate word of caution for conservative Southern Baptists which have historically believed in, and practiced, doctrinal accountability.

2) He admittedly considers other individuals which do not affirm the inerrancy of the Bible to be theological “conservatives.”

3) He admittedly believes that there were only “about four or five people in leadership positions at our seminaries that needed to be dealt with” prior to, and during the early stages of the Conservative Resurgence.

While Burleson does not believe these to be important issues, they are most certainly important to many conservative Southern Baptists. In fact, many have found his comments rather alarming – especially when they come from a Trustee of an SBC entity. Thus, conservative Southern Baptists, such as me, will not be distracted from the REAL issues.

Thanks and God bless!!!

In Christ,
JLG

IN HIS NAME said...

Brad,

Praise be to God for the sharing of Jesus Christ and the Work of the Holy Spirit. Our Pray are with you. I pray those with mean spirits will get a life that is pleasing to God amd stop spreading their Hate.

In His Name
Wayne Smith

Wade Burleson said...

Jeremy,

I would encourage you to blog about what you believe.

People can read for themselves what I blog.

There's plenty of room in the SBC to hear from young pastors like yourself, and I don't think you are doing a very good job of representing me.

:)

Thanks,

wade

brad reynolds said...

Jeremy
Good Thoughts.

You said Wade "admittedly considers other individuals which do not affirm the inerrancy of the Bible to be theological “conservatives.”"

Did he actually say that? If so, could you reference that. I would like to include it in some questions I will be asking him.

I think you and I and others have some very legitimate questions concerning Wade's theological positions. I am going to ask him to answer these questions later this week. I feel confident he will answer them openly and honestly and perhaps this will help everyone to know where he stands on issues like women pastors and those who do not affirm inerrancy.

I would post my questions sooner but I am still working on them...I desire to work on them either late at night or early morning because of the more important work here.
BR

volfan007 said...

i went to wade's blog the other day and i noticed that a man posted that the bible was not inerrant. he said that it had many errors and contradictions in it. i looked for someone to rebuke this man, and it never came. his statement was allowed to stand.

i have seen people post in wade's blog that it's ok to have women pastors and deacons. and, these statements seemingly are ok in that blog room.

also, if you challenge these statements, or disagree with the posters who are for allowing everyone in the tent, then you are looked upon as a meany.

what does this tell us about wade's blog?

volfan007

ps. this was not written in a mean way. i was not mad, nor upset when writing this. i was not even unhappy while writing this. just full of the joy of Jesus.

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volfan007 said...

also, i have noticed on wade's blog that it's ok to call les and sbc pastor and brad and me and anyone else who disagrees with wade and what he's trying to do as mean spirited and narrow minded and divisive. but, as wade claims that he's doing what he's doing to encourage unity, all i see it as causing is strife and division. in fact, the only thing that this years sbc had any division over was the very things that wade and ascol and that bunch brought up. and, in the months following the sbc, the things that have caused the most division and strife have been the things that wade and his crowd have brought up and made a big deal over. is this really being for unity?????

volfan007


ps. this was not written with a mean and nasty spirit. this was not written in anger. this was not written with a grudge against anyone, nor am i trying to get anyone. i wrote this with a sweet spirit.

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Anonymous said...

All,

Speaking of women pastors and deacons. The BF&M 2000 clearly states that the Bible teaches that women cannot be pastors. The pastors of the church is to be men. Wade certainly agrees wholeheartedly to this, and those who are asserting otherwise are slandering and passing gossip.

As concerns deacons. (I speak for me). The BF&M 2000, does not address the gender of deacons. When I was at SEBTS, I was pastoring a church that wanted to ordain a women to be a Deacon. I asked requested an interview with Dr. Patterson to discuss this. Here is what DR P told me and I thoroughly agree with it.

1. Deacon "Ordination" is not taught in the bible.

2. One can make the claim from the Scriptures and from early church history that there were women deacons.

3. Deacons in the typical baptist church today do not function biblically as deacons should, ie usurping authority and acting as elders when they are only to be servants. Pastors lead and oversee, Deacons serve.

4. He would not have women serve alongside men as deacons, especially since deacons are not functioning biblically in most SBC churches.

5. If he were a pastor, he would consider having an order of women as servants, don't have to call them deacons, but they would have their own ministy and the men servants/deacons would have their own minsitry.

Straight from Dr. P's mouth, (not word of word, it was several years ago, but these points were clearly spelled out).

I think too many Baptist churches are Deacon-possessed!

Tim

Tim said...

Terrance and Bill,

I read and re-read Marty's art. He certainly said that Jesus might have had a "wet-dream." Very crass, really unnecessary, not respectful, not needed in talking about Christ's humanity. Biologically could this have happenend? I dont know, possible but definitly no need to speculate on this. We know that Scritpure says He was tempted, but sinless!

WHERE DID HE SAY that Jesus looked at hooters girls? You both said this, re-read his art, did he take it out? It is not there now.

Tim

Anonymous said...
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Sick of it said...

After reading all these blogs, I think Paul should have warned against all the busybodies in the ministry. Pastors are just as bad in being gossips and slanderers then anybody. I include myself, God forgive me!

Again, the BF&M should be enough, and we all need to shut up over any issues that are not addressed therein. If you want to kick me out over an issue that is not in this document, then get it passed and keep fighting. If you say you want to fellowship with me even in spite of issues of disagreement that are not addressed in the BF&M then let me serve and shut up about the issues that divide, unless you really want to be divisive!

Sick of it,

Wade Burleson said...

Some of you must realize I have not even read Marty's post.

I will . . . soon --- after I return from preaching the gospel at one of our retirement centers in OKC.

Terrence, Bill, Brad, Volfan and anyone else --- ask your questions of Marty.

Also, don't be surprised if people, possibly even me, express disagreement with some of Marty's conclusions --- if how you represent them is accurate (and that is a big "if.")

I realize that there is already disagreement on this comment string of what Marty said or did not say.

I'll reserve judgment till I read it.

I won't reserve judgment, however, or those who attack me for what somebody else has written.

Follow Scripture.

Be obedient to Christ.

Talk to Marty.

Anonymous said...
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Wade Burleson said...

Brad,

I think you have one person posting multiple anonymous comments using different names.

Check your ISP.

It's called flaming.

Anonymous said...

Terrance,

You said, "Marty the Garbage Man Duran has just accused Jesus of having Wet Dreams and gazing at the Hooters girls!"

1. Agree or disagree with Marty, it is wicked of you to call your brother "the garbage man."

2. Unless Marty took something off his post, he did not say that Jesus ever was "gazing at Hooters girls." And unless Marty took something off his post, you are sadly guilty of a lie and of slander.

Tim

Anonymous said...

Dr. Reynolds,

As a woman who tries to live out Christ in my daily life I am stunned that a preacher of God's word would accuse Jesus of the things that Mr. Duran has done. I still can't believe he accused our Lord of the same sexual functions that teenage boys have. He should be dealt with, but there is no accountability in this blog world.

Therefore it is with great reservation that I say "Mr. Bill Dickson, if you are serious about taking these issues to the newspapers, then I too will contribute. Count me in also. $100.00 if it will put an end to this terrible mess."

Mallory

Let me know where to send a check

Marty may God have mercy on your soul for the newspapers will not.

And do not send your pitful wife on here to chastize me. She too should be appauled by your lack of respect for our Lord. But then again ...

SWBTS Underground said...

Dr. Reynolds,

I would advise that you address the biblical response to those who want to take information like this to a city newspaper. You men who can even consider this are the reason why so many in my generation are desiring to plant churches.

Terrence,
Wade clearly stated, "the church we were called to pastor." I cannot count how many conservative pastors I have heard say that exact same thing. You are reading into his statement something he did not say. I would suggest getting the answer directly from him before engaging in any more slander, ie sin.

Dr. Reynolds, this is getting bombastic, and is losing credibility by the second. As men mentioned above, Wade doesn't comment or rebuke every commenter on his site. However, I will give him credit for ceasing strings like this that have little biblical attitude and are unrelenting. On other issues and commenters, if he is like the rest of us, he doesn't even bother wasting time on the most outrageous of comments, especially those that are way left.

Tim said...

I guess I am missing something here, what in the world do the newspapers have to do with all this? You take this to the newspapers, 1. they will laugh at you when you hang up, 2. they are not going to publish slander, even if you are willing to pay for it.

"Uh, yes sir, I would like to place an ad in your local paper. What is the content? Oh it is to point out the errors of a local preacher. Am I from around here? Uh no. What are the concerns? No he did not steal molest anybody, and is not doing anything illeagal that I am aware of. Actually, It is an issue of theology!"

I am so sure the local papers will love to use their space to report about another church fight. I cant believe that you think they would even be interested, even if you wanted to pay for it.


Tim

tim rogers said...

To my Brothers and Sisters,

It appears that Brother Marty has removed his post. We need to stop the rhetoric.

Having said that, Brother Brad I pray you will be okay with my next statment. If not just delete it and I will understand.

First, to go to a newspaper with concerns and take out ads is not the thing to do.

Second, unless you are a member of the church Brother Marty Pastor's you have no offense with him as a Pastor. You have no right to speak against his Pastoral skills or duties. If you are a member of the church he has the honor to pastor, this is not the forum in which to address your concerns.

To all,
Brother Marty has evidently decided his post was not a wise one. We all need to acknowledge his actions and encourage him at this time. People make mistakes sometimes and their actions are not viewed as they sometimes wish. However, our response should always be one in grace and love and when those actions are corrected we should affirm their decision.

Marty, Thank you for removing that post. Your slip in judgment is commendable because it tells me you are human. You are my Brother in Christ and I affirm you in your ministry in Georgia. Lord knows Georgia needs the gospel.:) I understand because of the location of the state preachers will drive to Alabame, Tenn, Florida, and South Carolina in order to talk with God. I am told in Georgia it is a long distance phone call to God.:)

Blessings,
Tim

Paul Burleson said...

All,

I've never read anything written by anyone that I would agree with every word or turn of thought. But, having studied much concerning the Divine and Human nature of Christ and holding firmly to the miracle of both in that unique One who is our Lord, I can and do agree with the primary point being made by Marty. [He would be the first to say I'm sure, that logic comes into play here since scripture is silent on much of his early years.]

Should/can it be said differently? I'm sure it could, depending on the personality and style of the one writing. But, when writing, especially about sensitive matters, and the nature of our Christ is a sensitive matter, one does not usually think of the fact you may be writing to a Judge and Jury instead of to people who struggle with Truth that is sometimes difficult to present.

I'm not sitting in judgement of a person, style, motives, or anything else for that matter. I happen to agree with the MAJOR premise a fine young man was attempting to make and deeply appreciate anyone who tries to think through the tough stuff of theology.

Marty Duran is one of those unique men who have both a passion for Truth and a passion for the One who is our Truth. May his tribe increase. And I stand by every word in my comment on his blog.

Thank you Brad for providing the comment opportunity and may God's blessing be upon you while you're there and your family while they are here.

Paul Burleson

tim rogers said...

Brother Paul,

While your defense of Brother Marty is admirable, you have to admit there is no defense for his liberty in logic. Face it, it was a slip of wisdom and he has accepted his flaw. I feel it is best to go where Marty went and acknowledge it was not wise to post. Let's not make the matter any more difficult by trying to defend this slip. It is just proves that Marty is human.

Blessings,
Tim

Paul Burleson said...

Tim,

Slips never need defending except against the one who never does. So I guess we can all give up defending slips. I have. But to defend a friend as to his person and character, I always will, when I know him and am qualified to do so. Thank you for your thoughts however.

Paul B.

sbc pastor said...

Bill Dickson,

Would you please send me an email? You can find my email address listed on my profile. Thanks and God bless!!!


All,

I too am concerned with several of the statements that a few others have made. However, I do not believe that it would be appropriate to castigate them by placing an article in their local newspaper. In my humble opinion, that would be crossing a line that needs never to be crossed. Thanks and God bless!!!

In Christ,
JLG

volfan007 said...

the man who posted on wade's blog was named william madden. he did state that the bible was not inerrant, and that it did have errors and contradictions. go back to wade's blog under comments under joshua convergence, amen to the principles and oh my to some of the statements and read it.

the answer that wade gave to this was... and i quote...

William also said,

"Wade, I know you will not agree
me."

He's right. I don't agree.

But I respect him as a brother in Christ, and refuse to yell at him, slander his character, or wish harm to him or his ministry.

I know that is your heart as well.

Fri Sep 29, 11:19:15 AM
end of quote


i ask all of yall...do yall consider a man who denies the accuracy of the bible as a christian brother? do yall consider a man who denies that the bible is Gods Word as a brother in Christ? i dont. i have another word for them. it's a bible word that jude and john used a lot. it's called apostate, or false teacher.

volfan007

ps. this post was not written in anger. it was not written to be mean to wade, nor to anyone else. it was not written in a mean spirit. i am not going to put anything in the newspaper about marty, nor wade. i am not the grinch who stole christmas, and i am not the boogy man.

brad reynolds said...

Wade
Please read the comments more carefully. I have said nothing about Marty so I need not ask him any question...I didn't even know what was happening until I just got in.

Folks
Let's stop the feuding. I did not see his post. But I am glad, from what I have heard, he removed it. Such theorizing is unwise and unholy at best. Let's be grateful he removed it, and has shown wisdom in doing so.

Concerning the adds in the newspapers I've already addressed that and said brothers have no business taking internal disagreements to the world.

I think some of you may desire to remove your comments. I don't think they are edifying. Seek God's wisdom here. We will all give an account for the fire in our fingers as we type...let's be sure it is from God and not ourselves.

I will give you the opportunity to remove but am seriously considering enforcing some rules to make this more edifying...let's be mature enough thet we do it ourselves without me intervening.

Finally, if I find out someone is posting under different names from same ISP I will remove both names' comments...we need to own up to our statements.


Now - more importnat items. This morning I saw three more professions of faith. For those interested, the church we are working with disciples all those who make professions through a one-on-one discipleship program lasting upwards to 6 months. God is good.
BR

volfan007 said...

wade,

btw, i have not even mentioned marty in any posts, so why did you put my name in with those who had commented about marty d. please dont say that i have said things that i have not. please dont assume that i would say the same things as others. please dont put words in my mouth. you dont know my heart.


volfan007

ps. this was not written with a red, angry face. i did not write this post ro be mean to wade. i am not upset, nor am i for putting things in a newspaper. thank you very much.

Kevin Bussey said...

Brad,

Praise God for those who have come to Christ. I just prayed for you again! I think that all of the SBC can agree that this is something to Praise God about!

irreverend fox said...

Brad,

why are so many of your loyal commenters so unChristlike, rude, with out grace, uncharitable, intolerant, arrogant and some are documented liars? why do they gravitate and feel at home at your site?

Phil and Mary Ann said...

Brad

I am posting this here and on Wade's blog b/c these two are perhaps some of the most read of the SBC blogs. I need to preface what I am about to say and tell you who I am and my situation. My name is Phil Hopkins. I did a Ph.D. under Keith Eitel at SEBTS and was his teaching fellow for ~5 years. I am a “Five Point Calvinist.” My dissertation was on John Piper’s understanding of theology (Calvinism) and how it promotes missions. I respect Eitel and Patterson and consider them friends. I also respect Tom Ascol and consider many others of the Calvinistic persuasion co-laborers. We do not always agree, but the three people mentioned as well others pray for my wife and me on a regular basis and receive frequent updates.

Currently, we are working among several very unreached peoples in Central Asia. We are the only company people in this country. We have virtually zero Christian fellowship. However, we are blessed to have outstanding supervisors and an excellent God-centered, US fellowship that prays, cares and communicates regularly with us. We are humbled that God has chosen us for this work.

I say all this to say, we have to be somewhat creative in receiving spiritual nourishment. Sometime ago it was suggested that I survey the SBC blogs. I thought it may be a good way to keep up with current SBC events as well as receive spiritual edification. In part this has occurred. Some of the topics and discussions are a blessing to read. However, I am disturbed with some of the posts and comments on these blogs. People on both sides of the current controversy have delved into personal attacks, misrepresented positions and used ad hoc arguments to support their case. That not only leads to godless chatter (2 Tim 2.16), it is sin.

From an international worker in a difficult situation, I beg the bloggers, if you are going to debate:

1. Show integrity. Represent the opposition in the same manner they would represent themselves. If you are correct, your critique will be stronger. If you are wrong, you will learn.

2. Stop the personal attacks. Only God knows a person’s motivation. If you are unsure, do not publicly question, privately ask. If you are upset with another person, call him on it, literally (Matt 18). If you do not receive an answer, do not speculate. Similarly, realize in many cases, you do not have all the facts; nor is it your right to have them.

3. Edify. If you cannot say the truth in love, and say it to build up, do not say it. Eph 4.15; 4.28 applies to us all.

4. Check your pride at the door. I learned just as much if not more from scathing, yet kind critiques than from people always agreeing with me. It is ok to be wrong and admit it.

5. Get your wife or another female to proof your posts and responses. Ladies tend to have a more tender heart and see things that maybe misunderstood. This will also give time for you to reread the comment. If you are really excited about the post at hand, that can only be a good thing.

peter lumpkins said...

Dr. Reynolds,

I am getting more puzzled as I read the posts here. Not your posts, my Brother. Rather, the curious chatter that seems to continually bleed out from some of the commenters.

Maybe one has just been fired from a job. Or, another has discovered his son did not make first string. Who knows what tragedy some have faced.

On the other hand, I don't know why such inwardly dissatisfied folk seem so comfortable typing on a keyboard insults they obviously would not communicate to someone eye-ball to eye-ball.

Rodney King's words resonate well today: "Why can't we all just get along?"

I trust you are seeing souls saved there on your mission. With that, I am...

Peter

brad reynolds said...

To all:

Other than irreverend fox’s rhetorical comment my way. I believe most have stopped their personal attacks. IMHO some still need to remove their comments. Marty has asked me to remove them and I would however, at this point I don’t even remove ad-hominal attacks that come my way here.

Because of the feuding I have decided that from this point forward I will remove all ad-hominal statements. My biggest struggle here is that inevitably someone will claim I am biased in my selection of ad-hominal statements – I admit I am subjective but I want to try and maintain some semblance of objectivity. If I don’t remove a statement that you believe to be ad-hominal please e-mail me…I will send the comment to Peter Lumpkins or another blogger who has exhibited an open-mind a Christlike spirit for a second opinion.

Now can we let this dog rest? Even if Marty made a mistake, let’s let it go. He obviously is not promoting heresy or else he would have left it up and defended it. I think he was sincerely trying to delve into the difficult theological topic of the humanity of Christ. Something I don’t quite grasp – fully God yet fully man. I can’t speak to his judgment for I did not read it. But even if he used unwise judgment…it’s over…which of us have not used such unwise judgment. Perhaps we should reread the original post here.

God is our judge and Christ paid for our sins and Satan is the great accuser.
BR

brad reynolds said...

phil and mary ann

THANK YOU. WISE WORDS. EVERYONE SHOULD READ YOUR COMMENT.

BR

brad reynolds said...

Kevin

Thank you for your prayers and quite honestly I would rather talk about what is happening here than what is happening on a blog. It is refreshing.

And so let me share some more. We had over 40 decisions tonight for Christ. We showed a movie and I shared a quick gospel message. We then went out in teams to talk to those who watched the movie. The pastor of the local church received all the cards and they will be visiting for follow-up soon.

I was with three ladies from MS today, they have blessed my heart as they are learning how to share their faith.

God is so good.
BR

Kevin Bussey said...

Praise God! That is reason to celebrate! I will continue to pray for you!

tim rogers said...

Brother Brad,

I am calling you out. You are a L_ _ _. YOU CANNOT SHARE A QUICK GOSPEL MESSAGE. I know, I have heard you preach. ;>)

Praise God for what He is doing through you.

Blessings,
Tim

irreverend fox said...

Brad,

thank you.

volfan007 said...

sorry, but i just couldnt resist this. on wade's newest blog, he is trying to narrow the tent about blogging. lol. the man who is for widening the tent is seeing the need to narrow the boundaries for a blog. lol.

he is calling for ten rules of posting and for not allowing those who dont follow the rules. does that sound familiar? imb? other sbc agencies? requiring certain things to be true? bfm2k? huuuummmmm.


sorry for this post, but i just couldnt help it. lol.

volfan007

martyduren said...

Brad-
Thanks for taking action here. I did want to state that no permission is given to reprint my post either on this blog or anywhere else. It is protected.

I'm sure you readers would welcome a discussion on the deity/humanity of Christ, but my previous comments cannot be used.

Father,
Bless Brad in his endeavors today as he seeks to take the gospel cross-culturally. I ask that the Holy Spirit of the Almighty would give strength, clarity of thought and purpose of speech in communicating; that translators would not be confused by accents and colloquialisms; that hearts will be receptive to the gospel of Christ; and, that souls would be added to the kingdom.

I ask this in the name of Jesus Christ.

brad reynolds said...

Tim,

you are funny:)


Irreverend fox,

Thank you my friend


Volfan,

I read over your comment twice to make sure you weren't attacking Wade. I think you are just voicing concern...but if you are in any way trying to make him look bad rather than pointing out duplicity as you see it please rephrase your comment.
Thanks for staying alert though.
BR

brad reynolds said...

Marty

Thanks...I read your post today. A good post and I hope many will be blessed as we contemplate the depths of the two natures of Christ. Amazing, he who is omniscient grew in wisdom. He who is life died. He who needs nothing needed food for sustenance.

What an awesome God...to humble himself and become a man...and then to humble himself more by dying on the cross for our sins and being a servant (Phil 2). Praise the Lord - What a savior.
BR

Anonymous said...

Brad,

After reading Mr. Hopkins post, I decided to remove my comments, but your site will not allow me to remove my posts as they are posted under anonymous. I also noticed that at least 2 of the posts posted with my name were not mine.

Terrence is my cousin and I asked him about it. He says the same happened to him on your site but not on this stream of comments. I have 4 things to suggest.

1. Please forgive me for any and all unkind things said under my name.
2. Please remove all comments by me Bill Dickson.
3. Terrence also asked to be removed.
4. Remove the anonymous option for comments. Let us all get blogs if we desire to comment.

Sincerely sorry for any and all hurt caused by my comments or by comments made under my name. I will be setting up a blog account in my name so no one can post as me.

Bill Dickson



Marty,

sorry for your pain. I assure you that I will never use yuor comments from the removed post. However, I am afraid once it is on the internet it is public domain. I pray everyone will heed Brad's advice and let the issue be laid to rest.

Bill

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
martyduren said...

Bill-
Thank you for your clarification and kind words. Your decision to begin blogging will doubtless be fruitful in your life.

Brad-
Thanks. Godspeed.

Anonymous said...

Brad,

I know I'm a hopeless eternal optimist, [I trust it's because of a confidence in the character of God] but I have seen, in my opinion, a genuine working of repentence and graciousness in the last part of you comment section. You are to be commended for turning it all that direction.

I only have two or three remarks of a personal nature.

1) You are being prayed for in that ministry now being accomplished and I don't even know you. But you're my brother because of the Blood and your Lord is mine also.

2) Your family is being prayed for also today.

3) We all may need to think/rethink how what is posted/commented really does reflect on our Lord more than we often remember. I'm going to rethink it for me.

4) With all due respect...GO SOONERS... ;)

Paul B.

Paul Burleson said...

I'm not sure what mistake I made to cause the previous comment to register as Anonymous. Sorry.

Paul Burleson

Paul said...

Brad,

Despite what Paul Burleson said, and I have great respect for him and appreciate his friendship, I must say this without any due respect whatsoever: Boomer Sooner, baby!!

Paul said...

Sorry, I actually meant to shout that: BOOMER SOONER, BABY!!

Wayne Smith In His Name said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
brad reynolds said...

Wayne Smith In His Name,

If these men want their comments removed, I will do it. I appreciate Bill’s heart. Bill, thank you. God forgives us when we err and that’s what matters.

Wayne, I also removed your comment per my latest rules, because you did attack them by calling them “of the enemy.” Please feel free to rephrase your comment.

Thanks to all for your quick and kind responses.
May God bless.


Paul B

I honestly feel we can dialogue in the SBC without being unkind and we can disagree without being unChristlike. We should stick to the issues. Thank you for your optimism and wise words.

And to you and Paul – I fear my ‘horns’ may have their hands full Saturday. I will be on the plane during the game. But hopefully we will send the Sooners packin’.


To All

Great day so far, we were in schools we divided into 9 teams. I’m not sure how the other teams did but we saw over 30 professions with just our team!!! Those who make professions give their names and the church follows up with Bible study clubs in the school. What a great God.
BR

Wes Kenney said...

Okay, now the comment thread has truly turned ugly. Apparently there are no standards, as those who would cheer for a team named for land-grabbing thieves are allowed to comment with impunity.

As my favorite college team each Saturday is always the one lined up across the ball from the land-grabbing thieves of zero-U, this week I join with our host in saying (with all due respect): Hook 'Em

;-)

Kevin Bussey said...

Praise God for the decisions made today! That is exciting! I'll keep praying!

brad reynolds said...

Kevin
You have become a great encouragement to me.

God bless
BR

Wayne Smith In His Name said...

Brad and Bill Dickson.

THIS IS MY REPOST AFTER REMOVING The last sentence.


Brad This Bill Dickson must have a friend by the name of Ben Trammel or he is the same person, Toward the end of your previous post some slandering was taking place in comments in regard to attacks fellow Brothers in Christ and now they want their comments removed by you.

Please don't delete the comments, unless you delete all comments that slander Wade, Ben and Me

Paul,
Thank for shedding light on this place in Dallas and let the Truth set us Free.

Wayne Smith In His Name said...

Brad,

Why did you remove Paul's comment who shed light on who these people were???

In His Name

brad reynolds said...

Wayne

I think you are referring to my post "My statement on alcohol." not this post. Furthermore, I think you'll find that Paul removed his comment not me.

BR

Paul said...

Wayne,

I removed my comment after Ben Trammel had Brad remove his comment in question. I told him and Brad that if that comment were removed I would remove mine as well. I felt that if he corrected himself that there would be no further need for my comment to stand and feared that it might appear that I was making a false accusation against him since his comment was no longer available. I wanted to avoid that potential confusion. He knows what he wrote and so do you and I. If he has repented and the situation has been corrected I'd as soon we cast it all as far as the east is from the west.

Blessings, my brother.

brad reynolds said...

Paul

Wise Words
BR